Opinion of a believer in God and in the Catholic religion.

"Religion" comes from a Latin word meaning "to bind" (to God or gods). The conception of a deity is necessary for religion.

The Christian define Religion as the virtue which prompts man to render to God the worship and reverence that is His by right.

Objectively, religion is the voluntary acknowledgement of man's dependence on God through acts of homage.   

The practice of some form of religion is universal.

Morality needs religion.

 

The Catholic religion came from Christ given to His Apostles (Christ's first bishops, Peter being the head) and disciples from 30-33AD. Through oral (Tradition) and written word (Scripture). they, in turn, passed down the Christian Faith through the ages.

Through Christ, the Catholic religion is the perfect fulfillment (full development) of OT Hebraic Judaism.   

Catholicism, the Catholic religion, the Christian Faith, Christianity, the religion of Christ, Christ's New Covenant religion all are one and the same.  Different names for the same thing. 

 

Lula, I assume from the start now that there is nothing I can say that will even chip the armor of your precious RCC, but I still have my views so as meaningless as they are to you ... what for??? I count 22 religions that are considered 'major ones' but the offshoots number in the hundreds. I imagine that all 22 have something that tells them and their followers they have the right of it, but who cares ... oh ... the RCC does to the point of gross neglect. I don't have a problem with religion itself as that is straight forward ... you just believe whatever someone tells you MUST be true or you can decide for yourself as I have. But the RCC is a self-isolated entity … and everyone else … be damned.

Forgetting any specific theology, can you not understand what people think when they try to have a conversation with a know-it-all? I have never known a topic or subject matter that you do not claim full and error free knowledge of or that you fail to drag into your Catholicism for complete justification. And all this knowledge that you possess, you don’t even crack a technical book or read the first instrument or have the least bit of confidence in the human species … until they are converted of course. I wonder how one becomes so knowledgeable just from this conversion process of yours … that would be a miracle indeed.

BT, 

It came from Christ. 

St.Matt. 16:18-20, Jesus said, "And I tell you, you are Peter, and on this rock, I will build My Church and the powers of Hell will not prevail against it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of Heaven, and whatever you bind of earth will be bound in Heaven, and whatever you loose on earth, will be loosed in Heaven."

The Church that Christ built on St.Peter is the CC and Pope Benedict is his 265th successor.

Does it shock you that Catholicism is Christianity?  

Your views aren't meaningless to me. You wrote; I read and responded. We're discussing. 

 

Ya, I can agree with this.  

So then comes the claim of these followers of various religions that the tenets of their faith is right. Well are they? 

I must say no way. Of all the various religions out there, be it 22 or 122, only one is the true religion of God. The Catholic Church confidently and serenely claims to be that one religion. She is the only one that was given Christ's authority to teach on Faith and morals today as she did in Apostolic times.

There is just One Man in history that has spoken with the voice of both Man and God...Jesus the Christ....and there is only one Society that claims to speak in matters of faith and morals with the same authority as that Man. This claim is so imperious that all other religions when compared to her are on one side and the CC is on the other.

This should explain the special position that I as Catholic must occupy in any discussion on religious views.

This should also explain why the CC and Catholicism, true Christianity, is subjected continually to attack from some quarter or another. Why it is only the CC that is the object of widespread and inveterate hostility and of a misunderstanding that runs deep through generation after generation. No one is much concerned about the teachings or discipline of the other various religions.

Anyway, all things including time itself changed with Christ's Birth, Life, Passion, Death and Resurrection. During His life, Christ established the CC, man's spiritual pilgrimage in all succeeding time will follow her in until this planet has run its course and on "the last day", all will be before the Throne of Almighty God.

 

We are talking about Catholicism here, not Islam or Communism. The CC isn't a dictatorship. People are free to come into the CC and Catholic Faith and free to leave. 

Christ gave His authority to the CC and she has made certain claims....People do have the option to leave, ignore, etc. the CC and her Christological teachings. It is to their detriment when they do so. 

 

 

Lula, we are not discussing anything here ... it is just you telling me the right of things just as any good Catholic theologian would … but to the exclusion of everything else. The frustrating thing here is that you will not accept any physical evidence or theory (based on evidence) as anything but the devils work. This complete disregard for men and their knowledge doesn’t seem to touch such things as our medical ‘wonders’, our surgical skills, our ability to ‘raise the dead’, our own man made longevity, our engineering and mathematical prowess … etc. I assume you live in a Home and drive an automobile of some sort all created from the warped dysfunctional mind of men. Would you understand a tech manual on the workings of an internal combustion engine? If not, how does your not-understanding change anything at all? You do not question the fact that the engine works as guaranteed and you do not have to figure it out to the most meniscal particle … your belief and support are just not required here (as in so many other areas) . What matter where the particles came from as this also has no bearing. But you at all times drag everything presented to (always perceived as against) you to your alter that is the RCC for theological dissection and outright rejection … forgone conclusions I might add. I know I am going to hate myself for asking this … where exactly in the Bible is it written that only the RCC and its followers may speak for God in all matters period … just as if God spoke it Himself? You really cannot see what’s wrong with this picture?

Maybe you missed my reply #8 ... this hatred is almost completely self-inflicted so quit whining about it. How could the world of man hate ‘Christ’ before he was invented by the RCC will forever be a mystery, hahaha?

How about some common sense and the laws we govern ourselves by for a couple of ways. Come on now, we are animals and none of the other species practice ‘type’ suicide. How long would we last as a species if we all went about killing our neighbors without cause, raping or fornicating with their children and wives, stealing their possessions, practicing infanticide and ritual sacrifice etc. [The RCC is guilty of all of this and many other atrocities as they spread (by the sword) the word of your RCC God.] If you need some kind of mysticism or a Book to so inform you religious folk, you guys are too simple to understand right from wrong.  You guys are dangerously undernourished from a lack of horse sense, fair terms, courtesy, humbleness, compassion, forgiveness, intelligence and most of all understanding of anything un-Catholic or requiring basic math or science. And somehow you feel you can justify this lacking through your self-imposed ignorance, with the pomposity of God himself and a complete disregard for all other humans (not under your influence) or their desires and wants … well it sure doesn’t work for me is all. Not very neighborly in anyone’s book!

OK, you're on to something here. So where does the sense of right and wrong of our words and actions such as you describe here come from?

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Now here you take you own virtue as a standard and proceed to find other people wanting when measured by it. It often happens that those who canonize themselves as models of perfection and regard Catholics as lacking these things you describe above.

It's impossible to truly be moral and honest without being religious. Religion is the highest form of honesty and morality, a strict duty to God. I'm going to try to get my point across by giving this example:

Jones owes one man $100.00 and another man $1.00. He pays the $1 but not the $100. Smith also owes $100 and to another $1, but pays the $100. but not the $1. Whose is the greater dishonesty? Now each one owes a tremendous debt to God and a lesser one to his neighbor. 

One may pay the lesser but neglect the greater. One's neighbor who fulfills his religious duties at least tries to pay the greater, though he may seem to you to neglect the lesser. But he is the more just, moral and honest at least in so far as he attempts to pay the greater. The one who is just to his neighbor, but does not bother in his duty of religion, is the kind of person who pays the baker for his bread he puts into his body, but nothing to God for the body he puts the bread into.

Another definition of religion...religion is a strict duty of justice to God acknowledging our indebtedness to Him. If religious people sometimes fail in morals, honesty and these things you name above, I don't justify it.  

It comes from the same place it always has ... the one with the biggest stick. Self-preservation alone given ample time (to overcome irrational superstition) is enough for people to weed out their own bad apples. Too bad we are incapable of holding governments or Churches to this lowly ideal of man.Are you serious ... I had to look up the word ‘canonize’ just to be sure and I refuse to allow you to use such Catholic terms when referencing me … hahaha. It is simple remember … I write, you read and you correct comment on everything I say … business as usual. What do my ideas have to do with perfection … an impossible state of affairs, RCC excluded of course? Are you trying to say that Catholics are lacking in those things I described above for no other reason that “I” find them virtuous and universal???
 
Jones and Smith will have to deal with their ‘plight’ without my help, but I would say they need to pay all their debts or face the consequences for their actions. I have trouble with your hypothetical parables so I will pose a more realistic example for you. You are a Catholic zealot living in Germany and you have ‘Jewish’ refugees in your attic. A Nazi patrol knocks on your door and asks you if you know where the refugees are hiding … how will you answer? I am sure you know what I would say with my hedonistic morals such as they are … but how about you?

Lula, you guys have had your go with things for a thousand years ... the top dog ... the biggest stick (you are silly). Well that time is long gone now so get used to it. You have failed to prove anything besides the fact that you are the most outlandish and hypocrital excuse artist I know. Proof requires more that quoting some parables from your bible ... let alone the internal nonsense your Church created to authorize its rape of the world. Voluntary conversion is one thing but conversion by force and by the sword is another matter indeed. You make no sense when you talk about "The universe and all that's in it, including animal, plant and human life (as if you are somehow gifted with ‘universal’ knowledge) is evidence (evidence of what???). They reveal God to us as the First Cause." (What first cause are you babbling about???). Why do you disregard the obvious proof all around you? I don’t care what your superstitions are … only a fool would blatantly refuse to even acknowledge the prowess of man in his own right. I can offer you proof aplenty … but you will not acknowledge any of it as such preferring to believe some words written centuries ago by idiots (by today’s standards) who believed the world was flat and completely discovered. You try to take what we know today through the efforts of man and pretend this knowledge had been evident to your founders too … and this is codswallop. This is just the Catholic way of pretending that the ancients were actually intelligent and capable of knowing everything we know today … poppycock indeed. And if they didn’t (couldn’t) know what we know today, then they were obviously misinformed by your powers that were (are). This is no different than your claim that you yourself are blessed with this absolute knowledge of your God and the whole universe … absurd I say. I know you don’t know much (if anything) about the real universe simply because you do not even know how to discuss it. If you actually believe that the Earth is less than 10,000 years old … then you have told me everything I need to know about your inherent knowledge and your reasoning skills.

The Bible is made up of the OT (book of the Jews) which wasn't changed and writings about the time/life of Jesus that the “Catholic Church” selected from (amongst themselves only) many, many writings of the day some within fifty years of the death of Jesus) … and called that compilation the NT. The 'historic fact' that the Bible was made 150-300 years after the presumed events is true only because that was the period when it was compiled into one book. The Roman Catholic Church wasn’t in existence when this compilation was done and consequently the words “Catholic Church” do not exist in the bible itself simply because it is a compilation of events/writings, many hundreds of years prior to the existence of the Catholic Church. One would have to question your self- anointed powers over all of mankind as I do. The Catholic Church as an insult was called the “Roman catholic church” by British Protestants who rejected the omnipotence of the Bishop of Rome (Papa) as does much of Christendom today. The Roman Catholic Church today has many idiosyncrasies that are not shared with the rest of the Christian Church. The Great Command of Mission work demanded that the apostles "go into the entire World and preach the gospel" (what a misnomer that) … but this is where Catholicism began and where the RCC diverged from true Christianity. The Roman Catholic Church did not even exist as we know it today until the Schism … so stop telling me how you guys were first.

Now I know where the phrase “The road to hell is paved with good intentions.” Comes from … The RCC is pack full of ‘good intentions’ even though Heaven can only be reached through possession of a pure soul (your words) … which of course is humanly impossible. From the Pope down to and including yourself, all Catholics have the innate authority to sell salvation and make impossible promises to those that can deceive most easily … the downtrodden, the homeless, the forlorn, the uneducated, the crippled and the aged. This could be what is meant by “The weak shall inherit the Earth” … if it weren’t just another RCC scheme to raise money and to pretend they are gathering sheep (SINO) into the fold.

Please tell me you actually want to discuss Noah and family as this is one of many indefensible claims in the bible!

Lula, I watched the clip but there was nothing substantive in it. All Mr. Voris does throughout is pander to us mere people on how our belief in God will explain everything in the universe to us (so easy, no school) … and that knowledge as foreordained in your myths by the significance of the “Tree of Knowledge”, is the only thing in the world that can fight superstitions and advance us up a step in evolution. It seems that Your God erred as he only made two people and they both preferred knowledge to superstition … so now the RCC steps in to do what God himself couldn’t do … perfection indeed, hahaha. What in the world does finite have to do with anything? There is nothing infinite about the RRC or the Bible except your insistence on believing in ghosts. I know, I know … God works in mysterious ways which are totally beyond man’s cognitive skills … for only the RCC (which came 8,000 years after well everything) claims to know the Mind of God,  ... how quaint is that, hahaha.

 

 

 

Let's try again. You obviously have a sense of right and wrong. In reply #2, you said 

You don't believe in God, don't practice religion, etc. ....

So that's why I asked, Where does your sense of right and wrong (morality) come from? 

 

 

 

 

Lula the word Catholic doesn’t appear anywhere in the Bible. It was not even mentioned for many years after the NT was compiled by who else … The Catholic Church (RCC wasn’t in existence then), but what are a few facts against superstition? Apostles, that’s a Catholic thing in the NT, right? This is the book compiled by Catholics for Catholics with just their own council … come on here; you guys just compile yourself into the role of “God incarnate” (for all Catholics … ONLY?) on Earth … and beyond, go figure.

Where does my morality come from … this you need an answer for, hahaha. How did tribes once unknown to the pleasures of an association with the RCC, everywhere actually … procreate and grow deprived of your silver tongues, without killing themselves and everyone else too for that matter. You see, the chaos you try to blame man for does not exist and never did in the real world. It only exists  in superstition where Man probably was fine till such time as he learned how to control everything with a god and of course the accompanying rule book on how to survive the experience. This superstition stuff is serious business because nary a one of them was able to produce one scrap of proof either … and they all refused to allow anyone to question their authority as they spoke for their god of choice too. I would have thought you guys could at least try to be authentic instead of repeating the same story line of many gods that preceded your choice.

I really don’t understand this question beside an innate desire to survive in society and from the auspices of The RCC, Inc. I am well read and educated Lula and I am not blind or stupid. I was impressed how you guys shut the Jews down though … classic that, hehehe. Lula, it would be easier and less time consuming if you could skip the RCC-C bible school lessons for obvious reason I would think, but that’s just me. Who in their right mind would want to everything is beyone me??? Is that even possible???