I don't know if the problem is really about the act of sex as it is in choosing a partner.

I think that with all the talk about safe sex the focus has been on the act and not on the human element of persona. Sure people make bad judgement when it comes to getting some, but what about teaching someone how to choose a partner.

There's the tricky part, right? If all you have to do is explain the act (as if that's not a can of worms) then you get to avoid a lot of really sticky stuff about being judgemental. Sadly, I guess this a lesson that we only learn through age. And some of us not even then.

Personally, I think the act of sex is not such a big deal. It's the who you do it with that makes all the difference for the outcomes.

When my mom was in university, one of her professors said something about "would you marry the person you're dating now?" It had something to do with sex/ culture. I don't remember. I remember my mom telling me that after that class, she took a hard look at the guy she was dating and dumped him. Then she and my dad met and the got married something like 8 months later. I guess she could see being married to him.

That conversation really had an impact. If I don't want to be with someone for the rest of my life, why bother dating them not to mention sex. Maybe I could have dated more often, but the few times I broke that rule I always felt lucky when I ended it without consequence.

I'm seeing this among my students. I teach middle school--mind you. Girls gone wild videos filmed on cell phones in the bathroom and posted on myspace. Eighth grader had third abortion. Another dropped out to care for preemie. Another who feels superior because her sister was pregnant at 11 and she didn't give it up till whe was twelve becasue God told her this boy was the one (he has a car). Dance moves at school dances that men in rain coats used to pay for at "gentlemen's clubs". I am so sad I can hardly see straight. In many cases the parents are complicit. They've had abstinence based sex-ed. My observations: no cool abstinent role models, no abstinent role models period, big old double standard, a firm belief that we are suffering from fogey-ism and they do too know what love is, a firm belief that they are in fact indestructible. They have asked me questions that have made my toes curl--can you get pregnant from (insert your various deviant act here)? it is true you can get bugs down there? if you're a virgin and your period stops coming are you pregnant? Do you think abortion is a sin? Did you save it for marriage? I answer them frankly and tell them to talk to their moms. They desperately want guidance and they aren't buying do as I say not as I do.

Finally, I had them list (silently)all the girls they knew that gave it up and regretted it. Then to list all the girls they knew (including me--and I'm barely cool enough to count) who waited. How many of them regretted their decision? ( I say girls because this particular class has no boys in it). Why aren't they still playing with Barbie dolls at this age?

Again, I'm so so sad.


And to the kid across the street...two words...paternity test.

"would you marry the person you're dating now?" It had something to do with sex/ culture. I don't remember. I remember my mom telling me that after that class, she took a hard look at the guy she was dating and dumped him. If I don't want to be with someone for the rest of my life, why bother dating them not to mention sex.

I heartily agree. More than any moral judgement, I think that this reason is more effective at promoting abstinance. Unfortunately, the example out in the world is that of parents having only a glancing notion of a relationship, living separately and comppletely disengaged from raising the child. The more kids see that example, the less weight this argument can hold with them.

And I don't buy the innocent, responsible boy v. manipulative, evil, crazy girl. That's some momma spin right there.

Yeah, lots of momma spin on this. I'm sure the truth lies somewhere inbetween. I have seen her kids and they are unusually level headed, I've also seen the sexed up little girl who manipulates everyone in sight. I don't care WHO instigated the sex...they were both complicit. And he doesn't want to be with ehr for the rest of his life.

And to the kid across the street...two words...paternity test.

That is going to be done BEFORE his name is on the birth certificate.

IN the end, the worst thing that can happen to you is not a child. It is much worse

I was thinking (but didn't ask) that since this girl was not a virgin to start...should he be tested for anything else? Sigh.

Not that this would solve the problem, but maybe the concept of a male bcp isn't such a bad idea. That is a topic for another debate.....

I think that sex ed is way off base.  They need to teach abstinence *and* all forms of birth control.  At the end, I think the girls need to go to "mommy boot camp".  Have them spend a week doing nothing but caring for "babies" ( see: http://www.realityworks.com/realcare/index.html ).  The boot camp should be staffed by people that will wake the "mom" up if she doesn't get up with the "baby".  The "mom" should also have to cook, clean, grocery shop and do finances while in boot camp. 

 

My view is this:

First of all, virgins are no longer prized as they used to be (back when their was a bride price). The promiscuous are the ones that seem to be glorified at least through attention. Cultural perception has changed drastically. Difficult to have self control when divorced mom is bringing home different guys?

Secondly, many youth today struggle with self worth. So many parents are too busy trying to better their lives don't teach their child's self worth especially in viginity.

Third, I have yet to hear someone who waited till marriage to regret waiting!

Fourth, The hormes argument is weak. As someone already mentioned:
"Kissing leads to petting.
Petting leads to heavy petting.
Heavy petting leads to sex."
No one seems to be setting boundaries. I know MANY who have given their V card and said, "I was caught up in the moment." Boundaries like walls in a house are there to protect you and others. They shouldn't be viewed as 'limitations' but as the area of freedom. Once the boundaries are put in place and mutually agreed upon both are free to do anything inside the rules and both are protected.

We are spending too much time telling them what not to do without giving them an alternative of what to do and how to act. Abstinance is great but teaching them what to do to AVOID emotionally intense moments where the plumbing is doing what the plumbing was designed to do.

Just my thoughts

Adventure dude, you hit the nail on the head. Thanks for helping define the intent of my point without rambling incoherently like I tend to do when I run on and on and on.....

Hey Mason! I agree with you and there in lies the root of any abortion issue!

Darn double post. Read the second one

wow. I didnt' realize this was featured....I feel so cool.

anyway, back on topic,

Will 100% of teens follow that advice? No, but then they never have. But unless they are taught it as a part of an acceptable values system very few of them will even consider it. Today they are being taught that they are expected to be having sex and that's the wrong message to be sending

Kids (and parents) quote that condoms are 99% effective. That means if used perfectly every time there is still a 1% chance of failure. We need to focus on the FAILURE of "protection". 1% is a big number.
Nobody is perfect and the actual stats are less reasuring...The typical use pregnancy rate among condom users varies depending on the population being studied, ranging from 10–18% per year. According to a 2000 report by the NIH, correct and consistent (ahem, perfect case only) use of latex condoms reduces the risk of HIV/AIDS transmission by ONLY 85%. Let me say this again, that means 15% will get it EVEN IF USED CORRECTLY. HPV results are even worse... 70%. YIKES!!!

Kids need to think about 100 people they know. 1% means 1 out of a hundred. Those odds are only in the best of situations.....factor in reality and life and the number starts to climb. Add in chances of STDs and the number isn't just 1% anymore. Even if everyone of their friends is being "protected" 18 might get pregnant, 15 more might get HIV and 30 might get HPV. So it's not 1 out of a 100 that might have a life changing event.....it's 63 kids. That isn't factoring in other STDs or other situations either. Obviously this is a 'worst" case kind of thing, but if I am going to risk my LIFE, then I do think saying 1% is a lot more deceptive than 63%......

Somehow abstinence has become mixed up with religion in the minds of many people instead of the obvious common sense that it is. It is the only 100% means of avoiding pregnancy and STDs

If only more people would see that.

I'm going to teach my kids to hold out til marriage and love them whatever the outcome. I'm not teaching them abstinence to torment them and deny them the experience, but for the sake of the children they'll be bringing into the world. Children are most likely to feel secure & loved when born into a stable home with two loving parents. That leads to secure human beings who contribute positively to society. That leads to a better world

Kudos to you. I'm glad you uderstand and see the bigger picture. I know there is more there for you, but this much is applicible to everyone.

So what you are telling me is stop at 99 Doc?

Someone needs to teach them the accountability. When I went through Sex Ed. it was geared to say. DON'T do this or this will happen to you. My beef with that attitude is, you've told me what NOT to do but not how to keep from doing it. You are right Libidos are a powerful force. If you don't put in some restraining factors (especially in thoughts) the recipe is for disaster. My grade was the first year (in 6th grade) that they used the above tact. In high school we had the highest teen pregnancy %of students in Colorado.